Ourane

[omorfi]

Giorgo, pou pas!! (I just couldnt help myself from thinking about Mazonakis..).

So you telling me that it is a vocative form?

[Philadelphia]

hahahahaha

Didn't realise it was Mazonakis first name !!!! ... where's dya ?!? ,,, She would REALLY appreciate THIS conversation too ...

[Philadelphia]

End, hello Panseline mou !!!!

[Philadelphia]

AND hello Panseline mou ... sorry, heavy head tonight ..

THAT'S a "vocative case" BIG EXAMPLE !!!

"Η Πανσέληνος" is a "female" noun with the odd "masculine ending", which become "Panseline" in its "vocative case" ...


EXCELLENT STUFF !!!

[omorfi]

I just started to think about aggele mou, also a vocative form...

I remember it was some forms in Ancient Greek too, that had the masculine ending but was a female noun.. Wagely... haha

[panselinos]

Nai, it is. If Giorgos is directly addressed, it is.

Are we gonna turn this forum into an educational linguistics one or what?

[Philadelphia]

You ARE quite a "treasure" , young lady ... !!!

Left a "message" in your "Alkinoos" thread too ...

I really DO NOT wish to go away from you, "omorfi mou kori" ...

... but my bed is "beckoning" me to it ...

[Philadelphia]

Panseline mou, it was great to "see" you here again ...

By the way, the "Alkinoos" message was "addressed" to both you ...

Goodnight "angels of my nocturnal strolls" of music ...

See you soon, again in "Heaven" I hope

[omorfi]

Hehe, yes indeed we are gonna turn this forum into an educational linguistics

Philadelphia you know that you allready have stayed here for a long time, and you said you were leaving... Thank you! You deserve your bed!

I will also leave very soon..

[dya]

Originally Posted by omorfi

Giorgo, pou pas!! (I just couldnt help myself from thinking about Mazonakis..).

So you telling me that it is a vocative form?

What a nice surprise Omorfi

And here I am, Philadelphia, couldn't have missed such a conversation.
Please, note that I was not the one to bring the name up on this thread!LOL

Can I also add something about masculine nouns? They also lose ς in the accusative, too. "Είδα το Γιώργο"
No need to mention that the final ς is to be dropped in both name and surname, if that's the case.
If you address someone by his surname, it would be: kύριε Μαζωνάκη! (just an example!!!!) (kύριε-Mister! -vocative)

[Philadelphia]

... ...

yes indeed !!! ... actually, that is what I meant to explain to you about your previous "grammar" question ... about "allos" and "allo" ... !!! ...

... Pronouns too get "cased" and the loss of the "s" in the "accusative case" is what happened in your "example" ...

As usual !!! ... I am very proud and impressed by "my" students ...

You guys make me so happy ... People "FINALLY" learning Greek is a dream of mine ... !!! ... lol ... so, thank you for making it "appear in front of me" ...

[dya]

Thank you, Thank you! Yes people DO learn greek, regardless what others may believe when intoxicated with songs translations!!!!

aha! So that was the mistery with allo and allos!

[Philadelphia]

... yes, another "case" closed ... !!! ... hahahaha

[panselinos]

Not necessarily.

You mean the pronoun, dya? Then let's put it that way: Masc.: άλλος; Neut.: άλλο; Fem.: άλλη.

άλλος -η -ο: [álos] αντων. αόρ. (βλ. E3): έχει και δεύτερο τύπο στη γενική, κάποτε και στην αιτιατική πληθυντικού, ιδίως όταν βρίσκεται στο λόγο απόλυτα· γεν. εν. αλλουνού, αλληνής, αλλουνού, γεν. πληθ. αλλωνών, αιτ. αλλουνούς· με λειτουργία επιθέτου ή ουσιαστικού.

[dya]

Originally Posted by panselinos

Not necessarily.

You mean the pronoun, dya? Then let's put it that way: Masc.: άλλος; Neut.: άλλο; Fem.: άλλη.

άλλος -η -ο: [álos] αντων. αόρ. (βλ. E3): έχει και δεύτερο τύπο στη γενική, κάποτε και στην αιτιατική πληθυντικού, ιδίως όταν βρίσκεται στο λόγο απόλυτα· γεν. εν. αλλουνού, αλληνής, αλλουνού, γεν. πληθ. αλλωνών, αιτ. αλλουνούς· με λειτουργία επιθέτου ή ουσιαστικού.

You're kidding me!!!! I did not understand anything from the last part of your message! Besides the forms: αλλουνού, αλληνής, αλλουνού which I assume are the plurals for masculine, fem, and neuter......

So, translate...yourself, please, for the rest!

[omorfi]

Time to explain another thing, that I have been explained before without really understanding why it is that way.

Let's say the man's last name is "Μαζωνάκης"(lol) and he marries a woman, her last name will be "Μαζωνάκη".Is it only that way because it's a female form? Because here a last name is a last name, regardless how "male" it sounds

[Philadelphia]

Panseline mou, you make people dive in "deep waters" before they learn how to swim ... !!! ...

The "pronoun" άλλ-ος, άλλ-η, άλλ-ο, has a "genitive case" άλλ-ου, άλλ-ης, άλλ-ου ... and in plural άλλ-ων, άλλ-ων, άλλ-ων !!!

The "quote" from your book, is referring to a "poetic form" of this pronoun ... ... it is NOT the general usage of this pronoun !!! ...
It's the same as for example the word "horse" in Greek "άλογο" and its "poetic counterpart" of "άτι" ... The second "form" is NOT used in everyday life as such ... unless it is use to express "sarcasm" or "amazement" ...

...

[Philadelphia]

... the word "surname" in Greek is "επίθετο", ... sorry, on the phone ...

[omorfi]

ok, I'll remember

[Philadelphia]

... back ... "epitheto" to also mean "epithet" = "adjective" ...

[Philadelphia]

you see, basically the "history" of surnames is that, people would say for example
- I saw, Yorgo today ...
- "Yorgo" who ... ?
- Yorgo the Taylor ...

So, the "surname" IS in fact the "adjective" that "distinguishes" us from the rest of the crowd ...
Therefore, it is "subjected" to the "rules" of Grammar regarding "adjectives" (i.e. "epithets") ...

You see ?!

[omorfi]

Yes, I see perfectly!!

[panselinos]

Indeed. And I did not put that for dya, but mostly for me and you - the... special cases, let's say.
For dya was the line "Then let's put it that way: Masc.: άλλος; Neut.: άλλο; Fem.: άλλη." and I believe it was quite enough.

It's not a book, it's Kriaras.

[dya]

Thank you both for your explanations.

[omorfi]

root nr 9 in here right??