Learning Greek language

[lesenna]

Originally Posted by penny

well if you notice when you say d as english, you put your tongue exactly behind your front(above) teeth BUT δ you must place your tongue at the edge of the front(obove) teeth and so as to let the air come more easily than saying d...any help?

Yes, it helped me lots, now i could understand perfectly "δ" issue
About "i"s i am going to learn step by step
Thank you

[maria_gr]

About the i issue, we just have 6 i. We pronunciate 3 letters and 3 combinations the same. What is that, that you cannot understand? A big problem is the spelling, but this will come later...

[shady_david20]

thx lesenna so much
i love brazil ( specially soccer ) so much

[maria_gr]

Yes Shady, lesenna is right. I teach to you the modern greek, the language we speak now. Ancient greek is a dead language, none speak it. We learn ancient greek, but only cause it's the base of modern greek and cause it's really wonderful. In my opinion ancient greeks had reached the perfection. Especially the attic dialect was just perfect.

We still use some ancient expressions like εν τω μεταξύ, τοις μετρητοίς, εν ψυχρώ, τοις εκατό, εν ώρα μηδέν etc.

[shady_david20]

ok maria
i get it
but just little tiny question
i heard that the name (david) with v in moder greek
and with w in old greek
so did they call david (dawid) ???????????

[penny]

we don't hane this letter v as in english (about the pronounciation) we have it and it is n like net or national not like various....also there is no w in the ancient greek where did you heard that? this name in greek is δαβίδ....

[shady_david20]

thx penny
i get it

[maria_gr]

Diphthongs

Diphthongs. Two vowels sounds pronounced in a single syllable make a diphthong. For example:[ai] in νεράιδα (neráida), αηδόνι (aidóni) and [oi] in ρόιδι (róidi), βόηθα (vóitha).
Spurious diphthongs. An [i] (ι, η, υ, ει, οι) occurring before a vowel or vowel digraph (ου, αι, ει, οι) is often pronounced together in a single syllable: πιάνω (piáno), γυαλί (yalí), άδειες (ádies), ποιοι (pyí).
Such combinations are called spurious diphthongs

Double consonants*

Many greek words are written with two identical consonants that are pronounced as a single sound: θάλασσα (thálasa). This happens with the consonants: ββ, κκ, λλ, μμ, νν, ππ, ρρ, σσ, ττ: Σάββατο, εκκλησία, άλλος, γράμμα, γέννηση, παππούς, άρρωστος, τέσσερα, περιττός.
These pairs of consonants are called double consonants

*They cannot occur next to other consonant. For example: αγγέλλω-παραγγέλνω, κολλώ-κολνώ, διαστέλλω-στέλνω.
Exceptions are έκκληση, ανέκκλητος, εκκλησία, παρεκκλήσι.
Modern compounds having εκκλησία as their second component are written with one κ. For example: ερημοκλησιά, ξωκλήσι, Φραγκοκλησιά.

An σ before a voiced consonant

An σ is regularly voiced (pronounced as [z]) when followed by a voiced consonant (except in most cases for λ).
Ασβέστης (azvéstis), σβήνω (zvíno), σγουρός (zyourós), προσγείωση (prozyíosi), διείσδυση (diízdisi), Σμήρνη (Zmírni), δυσνόητος (diznóitos), Ισραηλίτης (Izrailítis).
Σλάβος (Slávos), ισλαμισμός (islamismos), Ισλανδία (Islandía).

The combinations αυ, ευ

The vowel combinations αυ, ευ are pronounced in two different ways.
a) They are pronounced [av], [ev] when followed by a vowel or a voiced consonant: παύω (pávo), αυλή (avlí), αύριο (ávrio), Αύγουστος (ávgoustos), Εύα (Éva), εφεύρεση (efévresi), ευλογώ (evlogó).
b) They are pronounced [af], [ef] when followed by a voiceless consonant: ναύτης (náftis), ευχάριστος (efháristos), ευτυχία (eftihía), αυτός (aftós), αυτή (aftí), αυτί (aftí).
The combinations αυ, ευ count as vowel digraphs for the purpose of syllabication and accentuation.

The nasal clusters μπ, ντ, γκ, γγ

In words written with μπ, ντ, the nasal μ or v is usually pronounced separately and the following π or τ pronounced [b] and [d]: αμπέλι (ambéli), Λαμπρή (lambrí), πάντοτε (pándote), πέντε (pénde).
Similarly, in words written with γκ, γγ the first letter is usually pronounced like [n] in “hunger” (represented below as [ng-] and the second letter (κ or γ) is pronounced [g]: αγκαλιά (ang-galiá), φεγγάρι (feng-gári), Αγγλία (ang-glía).
The clusters μπ, ντ, γκ, γγ, in which the first letter is pronounced through the nose as a nasal consonant, are called nasal clusters.
The nasal clusters μπ, ντ, γκ, γγ are pronounced through the nose and thus differ from the digraphs μπ, ντ, γκ, (see digraphs/B. Consonant digraphs). But sometimes the nasal clusters μπ, ντ, γκ, γγ are pronounced in an alternative, more analytical manner, as in words such as σύμπτωμα (símptoma), μέντα (ménta), μπάγκος (bánkos). In these the second consonant –π, -τ, -κ is pronounced not like the corresponding digraph μπ [b], ντ [d], γκ [g], but as if it were free-standing, that is, as [p], [t], [k].
The nasal cluster γγ, alone or followed by another consonant, is pronounced in certain words of learned origin not as [ng-g] but as [ng-y], with y as continuant (y as in word yogurt): έγγαμος (éng-yamos), εγγαστρίμυθος (eng-yastrímithos), εγγράμματος (eng-yrámatos), συγγνώμη (sing-ynómi) [but also συγγνώμη and siynómi], συγγραφέας (sing-yraféas). But the following are pronounced with [ng-g]: γάγγλια (yang-glia), γάγγραινα (yang-grena), παλλιγγενεσία (paling-genesía).

Silent letters

In certain circumstances some letters are not pronounced at all. In such cases there letters are called silent letters. Silent letters in Greek are:
a) The υ in the combination ευ when another labial follows (β or φ): εύφορος (éforos), ευφορία (eforía), ευφωνία (efonía), Εύβοια (évia).
b) One of the pair of double consonants: αλλού (aloú), πολλής (polís), θάλασσα (thálasa).
c) Π is often silent in the cluster μπτ: πέμπτος (pémtos), άμεμπτος (ámemtos).

WORDS AND SYLLABLES

Words

Words are separated from each other in writing. I say it cause in ancient Greek words were written all together as one.
Words which are written as a single word:
a) The numerals from 13 to 19: δεκατρία (dekatría), δεκατέσσερα (dekatésera), δεκαπάντε (dekapénde), δεκαέξι (dekaéksi), δεκαεπτά (dekaeptá), δεκαοκτώ (dekaoktó), δεκαεννέα (dekaenéa).
b) The pronouns καθένας, καθεμιά, καθένα, καθετί, κατιτί, οποιοσδήποτε, οσοδήποτε, οτιδήποτε; And also the noun καθέκαστα.
c) The indeclinables απαρχής, απεναντίας, απευθείας, αφότου, αφού, δηλαδή, διαμιάς, ειδάλλως, ειδεμή, ενόσω, εντάξει, ενώ, εξαιτίας, εξάλλου, εξαρχής, εξίσου, επικεφαλής, επιτέλους, καθαυτό, καθεξής, καλημέρα, καληνύχτα, καλησπέρα, καληώρα, καταγής, κατευθείαν, κιόλας, μεμιάς, μολαταύτα, μόλο (που), μολονότι, ολημέρα, οληνύχτα, ολωσδιόλου, οπουδήποτε, οπωσδήποτε, προπάντων, τωόντι, υπόψη, ωστόσο.
d) The prepositions σε (σ’) together with the genitive or accusative article: στον αφρό της θάλασσας, στο πεζούλι της εκκλησίας. The pronoun σου, however, is written as a separate word (and takes an apostrophe if the vowel is elided): σ’ το δίνω, σ’ το έστειλα στις τρεις στο σπίτι σου.
e) Compound place-names: Περαχώρα etc.
Also written as a single word are verbal expressions such as σούρτα φέρτα, δώστου, which are no longer felt to consist of separate words.

Written as two separate words: καλώς όρισες, καλώς τον (but καλωσορίζω), μετά χαράς, τέλος πάντων, and the learned expressions εν μέρει, κατ’ εξοχήν etc.
The following are written as one or as two words, depending on context and emphasis: παρά κάτω – παρακάτω, παρά πάνω – παραπάνω, παρά πέρα – παραπέρα, τόσος δα – τοσοσδά, ώσπου να καταλάβουμε – ως πού είναι το μάθημα;, σάμπως να είναι μακρύτερα από εκεί - σαν πώς σου φάνηκε;

[lesenna]

Originally Posted by maria_gr

About the i issue, we just have 6 i. We pronunciate 3 letters and 3 combinations the same. What is that, that you cannot understand? A big problem is the dictation, but this will come later...

Opppsss... in portuguese we have only 1 i Thanks Maria, and this "i" issue is now clear to me (and thanks to penny too ), i'll wait for dictation

[lesenna]

Originally Posted by shady_david20

thx lesenna so much
i love brazil ( specially soccer ) so much

You're welcome! if u have any question about brazilian soccer i can help u too.

[maria_gr]

Originally Posted by lesenna

Opppsss... in portuguese we have only 1 i Thanks Maria, and this "i" issue is now clear to me (and thanks to penny too ), i'll wait for spelling

Οk lessena mou. I'll put now spelling.

[maria_gr]

Let’s take a break from grammar and say something about spelling. In Greek there are some words that have the same pronunciation, but we write them differently. Of course they have different meaning ‘cause they are different words. They haven’t any connection between them. I like these words so much!!! I’m not sure if I wrote them all, I wrote what I remember.

Words with same sound

Nouns

Έγκληση=indictment (égklisi)
Έγκλιση=mood (in grammar) (égklisi)

Έκκληση=request (éklisi)
Έκλυση=emission (éklisi)

Εκχείλιση=overflow* (ekhílisi)
Εκχύλιση=extraction (ekhílisi)

Εξάρτηση=dependence (exártisi)
Εξάρτυση=kit (exártisi)
Εξάρτιση=rigging (exártisi)

Ευγενής (ο)=aristocrat (noun) (evgenís)
Ευγενής=polite (adjective) (evgenís)

Ικέτης=supplicant (ikétis)
Οικέτης=in the Ancient Greece “oικέτης” was the slave who was born and he was living in the house of his master (ikétis)

Κήτος=sea monster (kítos)
Κύτος=hull (kítos)

Λιμός=famine (limós)
Λοιμός=plague, epidemic (limós)

Λίμα**=intense famine (líma)
Λίμα=file (about nails) (líma)

Πολυέλαιος=chandelier (<πολύ + έλαιον) (poliéleos)
Πολυέλεος=most merciful (<πολύ + έλεος) (poliéleos)

Σορός (η)=dead body (sorós: femenine)
Σωρός (ο)=heap (sorós : masculine)

Στίχος=verse (stíhos)
Στοίχος=line, file (stíhos)

Ύπαιθρο (το)=open-air, outdoors (ípethro: neutral)
Ύπαιθρος (η)=countryside (ípethros: feminine)

Ωδίνες (οι)=labour, throes (odínes: plural)
Οδύνη (η)=pain (odíni: singular)

Κλήση=call (klísi)
Κλίση=inclination [of a verb] (klísi)

Κλίμα=climate (klíma)
Κλήμα=vine (klíma)

Τοίχος=wall (tíhos: masculine)
Τείχος=wall (tíhos: neutral)

Θήρα=It’s a Greek island [Santorini] (Thíra)
Θύρα=door (thíra)

Adjectives

Επικούρειος=epicurean
Επικούριος=supporter

Έωλος=yesterday’s||stale||old
Αίολος=changeable||decayed

Καινός=new
Κενός=empty

Κρητικός=the relative with Crete***
Κριτικός=critic

Σατιρικός=satirical
Σατυρικός=the relative with Satyr

Τυχόν=by chance, eventual, probable
Τυχών/τυχούσα/τυχόν=anybody

Ψηλός=tall
Ψιλός=fine, thin, slim

Verbs

Φιλάω=kiss
Φυλάω=guard

Ανα-στηλώνω=restore (<στήλη)
Υπο-στυλώνω=prop up (<στύλος)

Παραλήφθηκε=he/she/it has been received
Παραλείφθηκε=he/she/it has been omitted

Να’ μαι=to be
Να με=here I am||look at me

Indeclinable

Ό,τι=what, whatever
Ότι=that (e.g. He realized that he misbehaved)

Ο πολύς/η πολλή/το πολύ=much, a lot, many (επίθετο=adjective)
Πολύ=very, much, a lot (επίρρημα=adverb)

*I don’t know the noun, so I wrote the verb, but the Greek word is noun.
**These two words have the same pronunciation and spelling, but different meaning.
***Crete is a Greek island in south Greece. In fact is the biggest island of Greece.

[penny]

Crecian ή Cretian δεν είναι ο κρητηκός?

[maria_gr]

Δεν έχω ιδέα μικρό μου, αλλά κρητικός δεν είναι μόνο ο κάτοικος της Κρήτης, αλλά ό,τι έχει σχέση με τη Κρήτη. Π.χ. λέμε κρητικό τυρί κτλ. Είναι επίθετο και όχι ουσιαστικό!

[penny]

ααααα οκ

[maria_gr]

Τίποτα γλυκιά μου, γίνονται τέτοια λάθη. Π.χ. στο με τη Μακεδονία δεν μπορείς να κάνεις λάθος γιατί λέμε Μακεδόνας και μακεδονικός. Είναι διαφορετικά! Αλλά σε αυτή την περίπτωση είναι ίδια.

[maria_gr]

Syllabification

A syllable is part of word and comprises a single vowel or diphthong which may be accompanied by one or more consonants: ό-χι, αη-δό-νι, αρ-πά-χτη-καν, καη-μέ-νος.
For the purposes of syllabification, vowel digraphs and spurious diphthongs count as single vowels: αί-μα, ναύ-της, ά-πια-στος, α-μυα-λιά, για-γιά, γυα-λιά.
In normal speech, spurious diphthongs do not occur after two consonants of which the second is ρ. In these cases the two vowels may be treated as separate syllables: ά-γρι-ος, για-τρει-ά, μα-κρι-ά, χρει-ά-ζο-μαι.
Depending on the number of syllables it has, a word is called:
a) monosyllable, when it consists of a single syllable:ναι, μια
b) disyllable, when it consists of two syllables: παί-ζω
c) trisyllable, when it consists of three syllables: πα-τέ-ρας, τρα-γού-δι
d) polysyllable when it consists of more than three syllables: α-νυ-πό-φο-ρος, α-κρι-βο-θώ-ρη-τος
When a word has two or more syllables, the last syllable is called the final syllable, the second last the penultimate, the third last the antepenultimate and the fourth last is known as the syllable preceding the antepenultimate. The first syllable of a word is called the initial syllable.
In the writing, it is often necessary to start a new line before finishing a word. The word must then be split into parts. But the break cannot be made just anywhere. It can only be made at the point where one syllable ends and the next syllable starts. The division of a word into syllables is called syllabification.
The rules for syllabification are:
1) A consonant between two vowels forms a syllable with the second vowel: έ-χω, κα-λο-σύ-νε-ψε.
2) Two consonants between two vowels form a syllable with the second vowel if a Greek word start with two consonants: λά-σπη (σπίθα, σπέρνω), έ-βγαλα (βγαίνω), κο-φτερός (φτερό, φτωχός), έ-θνος (θνητός), έ-τσι (τσαγκάρης), τζί-τζικας (τζάμι, τζάκι), ύπο-πτος (πτώμα, πτώση), Αι-σχύλος (σχολείο, σχέδιο), ά-φθονος (φθόνος, φθορά).
Otherwise the two consonants are separated: θάρ-ρος, άλ-λο, περ-πατώ, ερ-χομός, δάφ-νη, βαθ-μός.
3) Three or more consonants between two vowels form a syllable with the second vowel if a Greek word can start with at least the first two consonants: ά-στρο (στρώνω), σφυρί-χτρα (χτένι), αι-σχρός (σχήμα).
Otherwise the consonants are separated and the first forms a syllable with the preceding vowel: αμ-βροσία, άν-θρωπος, εκ-στρατεία, παν-στρατιά.
4) Τhe digraphs μπ, ντ, γκ are not divided in syllabification: μπου-μπούκι, α-μπέλι, ντα-ντά, πέ-ντε, μπα-γκέτα, μου-γκρίζω.
5) Vowel digraphs, diphthongs, spurious diphthongs and combinations αυ, ευ count in syllabification as single vowels: αί-μα, νε-ράι-δα, ά-πια-στος, ναύ-της.
The same rules usually apply also to compound words.

[bogazici86]

I want to ask sth. I know that every name in greek has an article but are these articles grammatical or arbitrary like in german? When I started learning greek, I felt horrible because of these articles. I'm afraid of their being arbitrary as german.

[maria_gr]

The articles are not arbitrary. They must be together with the nouns. The same decline, g