"Ta Thavmata" by Pantelis Thalassinos*

[islandharper]

Hi,
Does anyone know the words and translation for "Ta Thavmata" by Pantelis Thalassinos. I have a difficult time making them all out. Thanks.

[mister Xazos]

Τα θαύματα
Ta thaumata

Να 'ρχόσουνα στον ύπνο μου σεμνή και λυπημένη
Na 'rxosouna ston upno mou semnh kai luphmenh
αγία που μαρτύρησε απ' όλους ξεχασμένη
agia pou marturhse ap' olous ksexasmenh
να γονατίσω ταπεινά και να σε προσκυνήσω
na gonatisw tapeina kai na se proskunhsw
να πω συγνώμη τρεις φορές και να μετανοήσω
na pw sugnwmh treis fores kai na metanohsw

Όμως αυτά τα θαύματα γίνονταν σ' άλλα χρόνια
omws auta ta thaumata ginontan s'alla xronia
τότες που ζούσαν άνθρωποι με καθαρή ψυχή
totes pou zousan anthrwpoi me katharh psuxh
που κοίταγαν πολύ ψηλά στου ουρανού τ' αλώνια
pou koitagan polu psula stou ouranou t'alwnia
και ξέρανε ποιο σύννεφο θα φέρει τη βροχή
kai kserane poio sunnefo tha ferei th vroxh

Να 'ρχόσουνα στον ύπνο μου σαν Παναγιά ντυμένη
Na 'rxosouna ston upno mou san Panagia dumenh
να μου 'λεγες η εικόνα σου που βρίσκεται κρυμμένη
no mou 'leges h eikona sou pou vriketai krummenh
βαθιά να σκάψω να τη βρω με χιόνια και λιοπύρι
vthia na skapw na th vrw me xionia kai liopuri
και να σου χτίσω εκκλησιά και μέγα μοναστήρι
kai na sou xtisw ekklhsia kai mega monasthti

[islandharper]

Thank you, Igrec, I shall work to translate this today, and, perhaps, to post it tonight.

[mister Xazos]

Welcome Islandharper.

[islandharper]

Originally Posted by igrec

Τα θαύματα
Ta thaumata

Να 'ρχόσουνα στον ύπνο μου σεμνή και λυπημένη
Na 'rxosouna ston upno mou semnh kai luphmenh
αγία που μαρτύρησε απ' όλους ξεχασμένη
agia pou marturhse ap' olous ksexasmenh
να γονατίσω ταπεινά και να σε προσκυνήσω
na gonatisw tapeina kai na se proskunhsw
να πω συγνώμη τρεις φορές και να μετανοήσω
na pw sugnwmh treis fores kai na metanohsw

Όμως αυτά τα θαύματα γίνονταν σ' άλλα χρόνια
omws auta ta thaumata ginontan s'alla xronia
τότες που ζούσαν άνθρωποι με καθαρή ψυχή
totes pou zousan anthrwpoi me katharh psuxh
που κοίταγαν πολύ ψηλά στου ουρανού τ' αλώνια
pou koitagan polu psula stou ouranou t'alwnia
και ξέρανε ποιο σύννεφο θα φέρει τη βροχή
kai kserane poio sunnefo tha ferei th vroxh

Να 'ρχόσουνα στον ύπνο μου σαν Παναγιά ντυμένη
Na 'rxosouna ston upno mou san Panagia dumenh
να μου 'λεγες η εικόνα σου που βρίσκεται κρυμμένη
no mou 'leges h eikona sou pou vriketai krummenh
βαθιά να σκάψω να τη βρω με χιόνια και λιοπύρι
vthia na skapw na th vrw me xionia kai liopuri
και να σου χτίσω εκκλησιά και μέγα μοναστήρι
kai na sou xtisw ekklhsia kai mega monasthti

THE MIRACLES

IF YOU CAME IN MY SLEEP, MODESTLY AND SADDLY,
A MARTYRED SAINT FORGOTTEN BY EVERYONE,
I’D KNEEL HUMBLY AND WORSHIP YOU
AND ASK FOR YOUR FORGIVENESS THREE TIMES AND REPENT.

BUT THOSE MIRACLES HAPPENED DURING OTHER YEARS.
THEN PEOPLE LIVED WHO HAD PURE SOULS,
WHO LOOKED VERY HIGH IN THE SKY AT (? -- I CAN'T FIND THIS WORD!)
AND THEY KNEW WHICH CLOUD WOULD BRING THE RAIN.

IF YOU CAME IN MY SLEEP, DRESSED LIKE THE VIRGIN,
AND SAID TO ME, “WHERE IS MY ICON HIDDEN?”
I’D DIG DEEPLY TO FIND IT, WITH SNOW AND HEAT,
AND I’D BUILD YOU A CHURCH AND A LARGE MONESTERY.

[mister Xazos]

Well done ! Bravo sou !

[islandharper]

Evharisto Igrec, for your praise.

But, please, do you know what this word means? αλώνια

I can't figure it out!

Here is the stanza in English:

BUT THOSE MIRACLES HAPPENED DURING OTHER YEARS.
THEN PEOPLE LIVED WHO HAD PURE SOULS,
WHO LOOKED VERY HIGH IN THE SKY AT (?),
AND THEY KNEW WHICH CLOUD WOULD BRING THE RAIN.

Here it is in Greek:

Όμως αυτά τα θαύματα γίνονταν σ' άλλα χρόνια
τότες που ζούσαν άνθρωποι με καθαρή ψυχή
που κοίταγαν πολύ ψηλά στου ουρανού τ'αλώνια
και ξέρανε ποιο σύννεφο θα φέρει τη βροχή

[GPS]

Aλώνια is the plural of the word αλωνι which means the threshing floor. They were commonly used on passed decades at villages. But you can still see some of them around Greece not in use though

[islandharper]

I thought that is what the word meant, but it didn't make sense to me in the context of the song. Is it an idiomatic meaning?

[GPS]

I would say that it’s more like a metaphor.


BUT THOSE MIRACLES HAPPENED DURING **PASSED YEARS.
**τότες που ζούσαν άνθρωποι με καθαρή ψυχή
totes pou zousan anthrwpoi me katharh psuxh
AT THAT TIME WHEN LIVING PEOPLE HAD PURE SOULS,
που κοίταγαν πολύ ψηλά στου ουρανού τ' αλώνια
pou koitagan polu psula stou ouranou t'alwnia
WHO LOOKED (observed) VERY HIGH AT THE **THRESHING FLOORS** OF THE SKY
και ξέρανε ποιο σύννεφο θα φέρει τη βροχή
kai kserane poio sunnefo tha ferei th vroxh
AND THEY KNEW WHICH CLOUD WOULD BRING THE RAIN.


*** Ι replaced “OTHER YEARS” with “PASSED YEARS” because it is followed by the word “τότες”. This word refers to the past.

TAKE CARE

[islandharper]

Thank you. I like that very much.

"But those miracles happened during years passed,
At the time when people had pure souls,
who observed, very high, the sky's threshing floors,
and who knew which cloud would bring the rain."

It's difficult, at times, to have known the Greek language first, but then to speak English for most of one's life. For example, I always have had problems with transposing metaphor from the one language to the other. I tend to think of certain things -- things I am familiar with (and these seem to be quite limited, at times, I'm afraid) -- with my 'Greek' brain -- and other things with my 'English' brain, and because of that, I can assume that many things will not translate from the one language into the other. But this must be a universal problem for translators -- because of how discourse in a given language reflects the cultural experience of its speakers. Thanks for helping see and articulate this. And for illustrating that it's OK to just state the metaphor, leaving it to the reader to figure out (to imagine) how it would be.

[GPS]

I agree with you, that translating a song its not as easy as it seems.
You cant take the song and just translate it word by word because the result will be by far diffirent from what the song writter meant.
It will always be a pleasure to be of any assistance

[Aristoteles23]

Thanks for all enlightening comments about this wonderful song. I would just like to add that some of its more 'difficult' phrases become clearer when you follow the biblical allusions.

Threshing floors as places of purification are a constant image in the old and new testament. "And he will thoroughly purge his threshing floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire" says Jesus (Matt. 3:11, 12).

Only 'pure souls know which cloud would bring the rain', says the song. For a bible reader, this can only refer to the prophet Elijah, who saw how "a little cloud arose out of the sea like a man's hand" and predicted that it would bring rain.

The way I read them, these biblical images reinforce the painful contrast between those pure souls of other years and the imperfect lover who is speaking to us in the song. He is certainly no prophet and no disciple of Jesus, so he can't really count on miracles to bring back his love ("bring the rain").

[islandharper]

Thank you so much for your post! I have been confused about this meaning, and an older friend of my grandmother was trying to explain it to me one day after church, but I did not understand it so well without the actual verse from Matthew. You have made it very clear for me.