To keep like little water on palm

Thread: To keep like little water on palm

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  1. milijana's Avatar

    milijana said:

    Wink To keep like little water on palm

    To keep like little water on palm is phrase meaning to treasure something, to keep it safe like it means a world to you.
    It is the first option Belveder gave.
  2. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by milijana View Post
    To keep like little water on palm is phrase meaning to treasure something, to keep it safe like it means a world to you.
    It is the first option Belveder gave.
    Well I'm sorry Miljana, I like your avatar, but you're not right. I know it - because I made the same mistake few months ago and was corrected.

    The idiom with paml:
    "have somebody in the palm of your hand also have somebody eating out of the palm of your hand

    Meaning:to have so much control over someone that they will do whatever you want them to do
    She's got her boyfriend eating out of the palm of her hand. It was such an amazing performance - he had the audience in the palm of his hand.

    And there's one:

    in the palm of your hand
    Meaning: under your complete control
    The audience was fascinated - he held them in the palm of his hand.

    Source: idioms/palm

    Tvoj izraz - google je dao samo jedan rezultat - baš ovu stranu.
    http://www.google.com/search?q=To+ke...r=&safe=images

    Čuvati kao na dlanu postoji u srskom jeziku, ali ne znači isto na engleskom.
    Prevodila si srpski izraz.

    (Izvini što prepravljam, i mene prepravljaju - i to je dobro, učimo. Nema ljutiš)
  3. Belveder said:

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    have (sb) in the palm of your hand (English) = držati (nekog) u šaci (Serbien)
  4. milijana's Avatar

    milijana said:

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    Belveder,
    My explanation is correct in this case.

    The first phrase is always: To keep like little water on/in the palm. And that means to treasure something and carefully take care of it.

    The other expression you are mentioning is: To make someone EAT from palm/hand. That means to manipulate with somebody, control somebody. But he didn't mean to control her, he was telling her that even if devil would torture him, he would still treasure her and keep her safe.

    The third expression: To HAVE someone in hands, means to catch someone doing something or to having proof of someone doing something, to have someone in control, to have someone locked...many of them you can choose.

    It is always good to correct others, however, this time I was right. When I translate, I try to keep the lyrics how they are originally, if they are understandable. I thought it was logical, but maybe it was my bad. Thank you for pointing that out to me. I will try to be more careful.

    lol, nema ljutim
  5. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by milijana View Post
    Belveder,
    My explanation is correct in this case.

    The first phrase is always: To keep like little water on/in the palm. And that means to treasure something and carefully take care of it.

    The other expression you are mentioning is: To make someone EAT from palm/hand. That means to manipulate with somebody, control somebody. But he didn't mean to control her, he was telling her that even if devil would torture him, he would still treasure her and keep her safe.

    The third expression: To HAVE someone in hands, means to catch someone doing something or to having proof of someone doing something, to have someone in control, to have someone locked...many of them you can choose.

    It is always good to correct others, however, this time I was right. When I translate, I try to keep the lyrics how they are originally, if they are understandable. I thought it was logical, but maybe it was my bad. Thank you for pointing that out to me. I will try to be more careful.

    lol, nema ljutim
    Shall I answer or listen to advice of Oscar Wilde:
    ".... you are wrong, Basil, but I won't argue with you. It is only the intellectually lost who ever argue."
    Last edited by Belveder; 02-07-2012 at 01:11 PM. Reason: Ko zna -zna
  6. Dzomba's Avatar

    Dzomba said:

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    Why do I always have the need to help the girls with nice avatars...
    ...
    I think (no, wait, I know) miljana is right on this...
    cuvacu te kao malo vode na dlanu - I'll keep you (treasure you) like little water ON my palm
    ...
    I posto vidim da svi govorimo srpski, msm da svi znamo, pobogu, sta znaci "cuvati kao malo vode na dlanu"...
    It's usually exactly this situation when a boy says to girl that she is so important to him that he will always take care of her, always be nice to her, protect her etc. etc.
    ...
    Belveder, you're now right on this, although I'm still not exactly sure what is your point and your translation of this line.... :I
  7. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    Why do I always have the need to help the girls with nice avatars...
    ...
    I think (no, wait, I know) miljana is right on this...
    cuvacu te kao malo vode na dlanu - I'll keep you (treasure you) like little water ON my palm
    ...
    I posto vidim da svi govorimo srpski, msm da svi znamo, pobogu, sta znaci "cuvati kao malo vode na dlanu"...
    It's usually exactly this situation when a boy says to girl that she is so important to him that he will always take care of her, always be nice to her, protect her etc. etc.
    ...
    Belveder, you're now right on this, although I'm still not exactly sure what is your point and your translation of this line.... :I
    Ok, give me an example of: "I'll keep you (treasure you) like little water ON my palm", link, a quote from a book.... whatever... let's see it!
  8. Dzomba's Avatar

    Dzomba said:

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    http://vukajlija.com/ko-malo-vode-na-dlanu/204016

    I'd like to see your translation of this line...
    ...
    So?

    This expresion may not exist in English, but, when translated from Serbian, it is completely understandable...
    And I think you might be missing the point here... The goal of our translations is to showcase how beautifull the language used in the lyrics is.. If you translate this any other way, you lose it all...
    Last edited by Dzomba; 02-08-2012 at 11:28 AM.
  9. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    http://vukajlija.com/ko-malo-vode-na-dlanu/204016

    I'd like to see your translation of this line...
    ...
    So?

    This expresion may not exist in English, but, when translated from Serbian, it is completely understandable...
    And I think you might be missing the point here... The goal of our translations is to showcase how beautifull is the language used in the lyrics.. If you translate this any other way, you lose it all...
    Vukajlija ti je izvor? Stvarno, dobra šala! Kao da ja umesto Merriam-Webster rečnika tražim definiciju na Urban Dictionary sajtu!

    I što mi daješ srpski link, ja znam šta to znači na srpskom. Mi ovde govorimo o engleskom prevodu pesme i izraza, i traži se dokaz da je gore navedeni izraz zaista postoji u engleskom jeziku - onako skovan. Dokaz da postoji - gde je?

    "This expresion may not exist in English, but, when translated from Serbian, it is completely understandable.."

    Vidiš da ne postoji. Razumljiv je za nas, ne za strance. Ali to je netačno na prvom mestu, ono ne može onako da se prevede. Može da se objasni na engleskom kako doslovno zvuči u originalu, kao dodatak prevodu i da se navede isti ili značenjem blizak izraz koji postoji u engleskom jeziku. Šta je "lost in translation".

    "I'll keep you like a little sparrow" - jel bi ovo bilo razumljivo Englezu da nađe ovo u tekstu?

    Ali ako prevedeš kao, npr.
    I'll keep you as the apple of my eye

    to bi bio valjan prevod "malo vode na dlanu" ili "zenico oka moga" (ovde bi moglo da se prevede baš kao što je u originalu, a za "malo vode na dlanu" još nema dokaza)
  10. milijana's Avatar

    milijana said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    Why do I always have the need to help the girls with nice avatars...
    Feeling so flattered, thank you Dzomba

    I think one problem here is whether it was meant to be said "I'll protect you because you are so valuable to me" or "because you will extinguish fire in me", and the second using correctly words "on" and "in" together with the meaning of the phrase.
    I think it is all about how people understand and "feel" the words of the song. I translated it directly just as it is in Serbian (using the "palm" in brackets, because I think it was what the verse was all about -about that idiom of "treasuring someone as if they were little water on/in the palm).
  11. milijana's Avatar

    milijana said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belveder View Post
    Ali ako prevedeš kao, npr.I'll keep you as the apple of my eye
    to bi bio valjan prevod "malo vode na dlanu" ili "zenico oka moga" (ovde bi moglo da se prevede baš kao što je u originalu, a za "malo vode na dlanu" još nema dokaza)
    You are having the point about the fact of the idiom not existing in English language. Maybe it is the best to just give notes below the songs if something may not be understandable, as you can see in some of my other posts I did that. I assumed wrong that idiom is understandable, but I also corrected it with explanation given to Yosis.
    Also, I believe it is not the best to change complete sentences in the songs, like it is some novel that can be said in the spirit of language. Footnotes may just be the correct solution.

    The original text is saved in my translation, and if you believe the song needs new one, you are more then welcome to post it.
  12. Belveder said:

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    I've just written the answer in PM. Situation - fixed!
  13. to hoću said:

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    I could not solve it either at my own place: in German, and this might be similar to English, we are used to hold something in our hand(s). We could maybe put or lay something on our hands or on the palms (of our hands). But this should be something like paper or a small "object", like a beetle. I think it is not possible to put water on our palm(s), because they would have to form a flat cup to hold it. And then you would say automatically, put it in the palm. (Usually, if we imagine holding some water, we would associate to hold it in (a cup created by) both hands. But this depends on the quantity of the fluid of course).

    Independent from this - I'm not used from Northern Europe to compare a woman with the preciousness of water. Indeed we associate freshness with water and use it here more for allegories of purity and clarity. But not as a symbol for the treasure that means our love.

    Thanks all of you for the insight in Serbian phrases and the problem of finding adequate illustration and translation into English.
  14. Dzomba's Avatar

    Dzomba said:

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    Ajde da pisemo na srpskom onda...

    Kao prvo, Belveder, ti mozda imas pravo tu... Ali opet, yosis nije sa engleskog govornog podrucja, pa nismo sigurni da li bi englezu kojem je to maternji ovo bilo jasno..

    Kao drugo, dobro, oni mozda nemaju taj idiom.. Ali sta, mislis da je "apple of my eye" bolji prevod? Ne slazem se..

    Dakle, mi ovde ne raspravljamo vise o znacenju, vec o principu.. (totalno si nas zbunio sa onim postom br. 6 u kojem si, ustvari, pisao sve sto si nasao u recniku).
    Po meni, uvek treba postupiti ovako kako je miljana prevela. A ako onda nekome nije jasno, onda ce da pita, kao sto je yosis pitao.
    Jer, mi nismo ovde da bi sada radili neke striktne prevode.. Poezija je cudna stvar (iako je ovo danas ubi boze daleko od toga, ali nmvz..) ... Mora se naci ta fina linija pri kojoj stihovi cuvaju svoje znacenje pri prevodu na strani jezik, a sa druge strane se cuva njihova originalna lepota. Nikako nisam za to da se pesme striktno prevode, niti da se idiomi menjaju za druge slicne, ali opet drugacije idiome, koji su uz to jos na stranom jeziku. (slazem se sa tobom, moze da se napise nesto od toga u zagradi, ili blize objasnjenje i sl.)
    Ovako, yosis je pitao. miljana ili neko mu je vec odgovorio. Problema bez.
    ...
    Ovo sto ti kazes.. Da taj idiom ne postoji. Dobro. I tvoj prevod bi bio OK i zapravo bez alternative da se radi recimo o knjizi, ili o filmu, ili sl. Citaoci/gledaoci onda dobijaju taj prevod, i ti si uradio los posao ako toj osobi nesto nije razumljivo iz tog prevoda. To se ne moze ispraviti kada je knjiga vec napisana, ili su titlovi vec uradjeni...
    Ali, ovo je forum. Mogucnot povratne reakcije je ono sto je lepota toga. Mogucnost suprotnog misljenja.
    Prvi prevod u temi nije obavezno i najbolji. Prvi prevod se moze srediti, popraviti, bolje objasniti.
    ...
    Ali, po mom misljenju, u njemu uvek treba sto vise cuvati lepotu jezika i draz pesme, a tek onda paziti na ostale stvari. Ti mislis suprotno... Pravila stranog jezika su tebi na prvom mestu. Pravo da ti kazem, meni je srpski na prvom mestu.
    A oni koji ne razumeju uvek mogu da pitaju sta im nije jasno..
    ...
    A ja i dalje mislim da je osobi sa prosecnim znanjem engleskog "like little water on my palm" sasvim razumljivo...
  15. Dzomba's Avatar

    Dzomba said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by to hoću View Post
    I could not solve it either at my own place: in German, and this might be similar to English, we are used to hold something in our hand(s). We could maybe put or lay something on our hands or on the palms (of our hands). But this should be something like paper or a small "object", like a beetle. I think it is not possible to put water on our palm(s), because they would have to form a flat cup to hold it. And then you would say automatically, put it in the palm. (Usually, if we imagine holding some water, we would associate to hold it in (a cup created by) both hands. But this depends on the quantity of the fluid of course).

    Independent from this - I'm not used from Northern Europe to compare a woman with the preciousness of water. Indeed we associate freshness with water and use it here more for allegories of purity and clarity. But not as a symbol for the treasure that means our love.

    Thanks all of you for the insight in Serbian phrases and the problem of finding adequate illustration and translation into English.
    You see, this has 2 slightly different forms...

    Cuvacu te kao malo vode na dlanu - I'll keep you like little water on my palm
    Cuvacu te kao kap vode na dlanu - I'll keep you like a drop of water on my palm

    They mean the same...

    ...

    But, the thing is, it's very difficult to keep a drop of water on you palm. That's the whole point, in my opinion. That the person will do everything in its power to keep that drop on his palm..
    And, of course, the water is very precious to him here, for undisclosed reasons. But it is.

    Btw, the idiom is very common in love lyrics and other texts, so we don't usualy analyse it so closely like this... lolololololol

    edit: sorry for double posting, had to....
  16. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by to hoću View Post
    Independent from this - I'm not used from Northern Europe to compare a woman with the preciousness of water. Indeed we associate freshness with water and use it here more for allegories of purity and clarity. But not as a symbol for the treasure that means our love.
    We say "clear/chaste as a tear" (čist kao suza), or "bistar potok" - limpid spring (water), so we do use water to refer to purity and clarity too.

    But I guess this "water thing" came from the East, where water is so precious (it's precious everywhere, of course, but there particularly)

    For example, the sign of richness in Dubai is to have a fountain in front of your mega-building (not just building itself!)

    And this "water in your hands" associates me with the scenes with Jesus - drink water from my hand. It's sign of mercy, help, condolence.

    And yes, women are precious as water here - and water if life. Can't live without water

    Again, in English, it's seems completely different - like they have it "like water"
    like water (informal) in large quantities: He spends money like water.
  17. to hoću said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    But, the thing is, it's very difficult to keep a drop of water on you palm. That's the whole point, in my opinion. That the person will do everything in its power to keep that drop on his palm..
    Oh, well juggled! You'll really infect me laughing when you proceed this parable
  18. to hoću said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Belveder View Post
    But I guess this "water thing" came from the East, where water is so precious (it's precious everywhere, of course, but there particularly)
    Maybe, but usually I heard something like "студена вода" from Bulgaria/Macedonia. This is in German the same. Cold fresh clear water for freshing and cooling in summertime. We cherish that, too.

    Can't live without
    It's here the same, Belveder. You know, it's not associated with preciousness. It's like air. There is no life without. We just don't want to buy it with coins. But of course we'll fight for it and give our blood to preserve it. What did you think?
  19. Belveder said:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    Ajde da pisemo na srpskom onda...

    Kao prvo, Belveder, ti mozda imas pravo tu... Ali opet, yosis nije sa engleskog govornog podrucja, pa nismo sigurni da li bi englezu kojem je to maternji ovo bilo jasno..

    Kao drugo, dobro, oni mozda nemaju taj idiom.. Ali sta, mislis da je "apple of my eye" bolji prevod? Ne slazem se..

    Ovo je alternativni prevod izraza "kao kap na dlanu čuvam te". Ako ti se ne sviđa, ponudi bolji..

    Dakle, mi ovde ne raspravljamo vise o znacenju, vec o principu.. (totalno si nas zbunio sa onim postom br. 6 u kojem si, ustvari, pisao sve sto si nasao u recniku).
    Po meni, uvek treba postupiti ovako kako je miljana prevela. A ako onda nekome nije jasno, onda ce da pita, kao sto je yosis pitao.
    Jer, mi nismo ovde da bi sada radili neke striktne prevode..
    Taman posla striktni prevodi, samo tačni prevodi.

    Poezija je cudna stvar (iako je ovo danas ubi boze daleko od toga, ali nmvz..) ...
    Slažem se.

    Mora se naci ta fina linija pri kojoj stihovi cuvaju svoje znacenje pri prevodu na strani jezik, a sa druge strane se cuva njihova originalna lepota. Nikako nisam za to da se pesme striktno prevode, niti da se idiomi menjaju za druge slicne, ali opet drugacije idiome, koji su uz to jos na stranom jeziku. (slazem se sa tobom, moze da se napise nesto od toga u zagradi, ili blize objasnjenje i sl.)
    Ovako, yosis je pitao. miljana ili neko mu je vec odgovorio. Problema bez.
    ...
    Ovo sto ti kazes.. Da taj idiom ne postoji. Dobro.
    Super što ste priznali, to je bio cilj.

    I tvoj prevod bi bio OK i zapravo bez alternative da se radi recimo o knjizi, ili o filmu, ili sl. Citaoci/gledaoci onda dobijaju taj prevod, i ti si uradio los posao ako toj osobi nesto nije razumljivo iz tog prevoda. To se ne moze ispraviti kada je knjiga vec napisana, ili su titlovi vec uradjeni...
    Ali, ovo je forum. Mogucnot povratne reakcije je ono sto je lepota toga. Mogucnost suprotnog misljenja.
    Prvi prevod u temi nije obavezno i najbolji. Prvi prevod se moze srediti, popraviti, bolje objasniti.
    Slažem se.

    ...
    Ali, po mom misljenju, u njemu uvek treba sto vise cuvati lepotu jezika i draz pesme, a tek onda paziti na ostale stvari. Ti mislis suprotno...
    Ko ti kaže?

    Pravila stranog jezika su tebi na prvom mestu. Pravo da ti kazem, meni je srpski na prvom mestu.
    Ne možeš prevoditi bez pravila. Pravila moraju da postoje - ja sam pristalica toga, inače bi nastao haos. Ja volim red. NAravno da je i meni moj jezik najvažniji, baš zato mu i treba najbolji prevod.

    A oni koji ne razumeju uvek mogu da pitaju sta im nije jasno..
    ...
    A ja i dalje mislim da je osobi sa prosecnim znanjem engleskog "like little water on my palm" sasvim razumljivo...
    Vidiš da Yosisu nije bilo razumljivo, pa je pitao. Znači da nije tako razumljivo.
    (Moram da iskucam najmanje 5 slova? Aj sad nek postuje...)
    Last edited by Belveder; 02-09-2012 at 10:07 AM. Reason: ispala mi rečenica iz citita, da je vratim u "oblak"
  20. Belveder said:

    Default Shop closed

    Quote Originally Posted by Dzomba View Post
    You see, this has 2 slightly different forms...

    Cuvacu te kao malo vode na dlanu - I'll keep you like little water on my palm
    Cuvacu te kao kap vode na dlanu - I'll keep you like a drop of water on my palm

    They mean the same...
    Are you starting the grammar discussion again with this "water on palm"? Better not...
    But I won't go further.

    Here's one nice Croatian song with our... ufffffff.... idiomčić (idiotčić!)

    [kgJV_oeZYds]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgJV_oeZYds[/video]

    Kao kap na dlanu drzis me
    I da bolji postoje
    Znam da voljela bih tebe
    ...


    And this one is for Džomba

    [ZOjbP7WOl74]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOjbP7WOl74[/video]
    Last edited by Belveder; 02-08-2012 at 02:19 PM. Reason: I've closed the shop