What does "official" means in "Επίσημη αγαπημένη" - can someone explain please?

Here's the translation:

http://lyricstranslate.com/en/%CE%B5...weetheart.html

Everything is clear except how the word "official" is being used.

I don't get it.

Can someone explain, please?

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Everything is clear except how the word "official" is being used.

I don't get it.

Can someone explain, please?

Guest of honor

Oh! OK - that makes perfect sense. Thanks.

I suppose the word is used a little sarcastically, no? Or more sadly than sarcastically?

Which do you think?

Means the perfect woman for him, even if they'll never be together anymore.

Thanks - this is an example of how one really needs to know a lot about how a culture uses its language to understand a translation completely. Once you tell me "Επίσημη " implies "perfect woman for him", I can see how the phrase "perfect woman for him" is an extension of the meaning of the phrase "honored guest", but that extension would not have occurred to me on my own.

PS - or maybe I'm just not that good a poet ... heh heh heh ...

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Thanks - this is an example of how one really needs to know a lot about how a culture uses its language to understand a translation completely.

I would say to know a lot about the basic principals a specific culture has been built upon.
If you're willing to find those of Greek culture try watching the 2004 Olympics opening ceremony.

"the basic principles" - well that's an interesting way to put it.

A friend of mine recently sent me this link:

https://www.youtube.com/embed/quhlxIqw_EA

I think you'll find it worth watching - the dancing is beautiful, and the dancers are all gorgeous also! (If Tahira sees this post, I also hope that she can view the link - that it's not blocked wherever she is ... Germany?)

But the question is: does this presentation "uphold" or "violate" the "basic principles" that Armenian culture is built on?

I would say that it "upholds" Armenian "basic principles" because even though the dance forms have been "modernized" and "sexed-up" a little, you can still recognize that the dancing can't be anything else but Armenian (and not just because of the costumes.) Every culture has its own form of "gracefulness", which in a way, is one of the "principles on which the culture has been built, and you can therefore tell Armenian "gracefulness" from Greek "gracefulness" from Turkish 'gracefulness", even though the cultures have borrowed from one another over the years.

By the way, if you do watch the clip, look for the moment where the camera pans to an Armenian priest in the audience ... I think he's trying hard NOT to smile ... because he's not sure if he should enjoy the show or not ...

Well I'm not the one to talk about Armenian culture, but I think this vid shows nothing,
I guess ARMENIAtheBEAUTIFUL may have a thing to say more than me.

When I wrote about "basic principles" of a culture, I was referring to that special "way of living" that consists a part of idiosyncrasy of a group of people with common characteristic which we can call "a nation".
Or in other words, the philosophical stance about life of a specific nation.

Regarding your reaction to the video: Ouch! But that's OK ... 'chacun a son gout', as the French say ...

Regarding your phrase: "the philosophical stance about life of a specific nation" - how many Greeks would agree that Kazantzakis succeeded in capturing the Greek "philosophical" stance toward life? Or if not Greeks, at least Cretans ...

I'm sure he would have liked to think that he succeeded at least in part.

That's why I think that a culture's art forms somehow express what it's about better than its philosophies - less chance for political opinions to distort things.

(Although of course politics can always try to suppress art forms, e.g. as in the case of rebetiko a couple of times ...)

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Regarding your reaction to the video: Ouch! But that's OK ... 'chacun a son gout', as the French say ...

I meant there's no SOUL in there, compared to this -> http://www.allthelyrics.com/forum/sh...l=1#post923939
or this -> http://www.allthelyrics.com/forum/sh...l=1#post923958

On the other hand if you want some "polished" Armenian presentation then check Inga and Anush in ESC -> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJvbxbqyAtk

Btw let's post the first one over here also

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Regarding your phrase: "the philosophical stance about life of a specific nation" - how many Greeks would agree that Kazantzakis succeeded in capturing the Greek "philosophical" stance toward life?

Unfortunately few .... but you can't blame humans for not wanting to criticize themselves; and Kazantzakis spotted on some of the weaker points of our behavior.

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

I'm sure he would have liked to think that he succeeded at least in part.

He knew he had succeeded.

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

That's why I think that a culture's art forms somehow express what it's about better than its philosophies - less chance for political opinions to distort things.

(Although of course politics can always try to suppress art forms, e.g. as in the case of rebetiko a couple of times ...)

True, but you have to HAVE LIVED in place to understand the differences and focus on the differences, that swing played on the vid you posted practically destroyed every try of my mind to create a proper image.

So if you've never been in Greece, as many photos as I may show you, you won;t be able to understand the basic differences of light, you won't be able to reconstruct a complete image with your mind.

You wrote:

****
True, but you have to HAVE LIVED in place to understand the differences and focus on the differences, that swing played on the vid you posted practically destroyed every try of my mind to create a proper image.

So if you've never been in Greece, as many photos as I may show you, you won;t be able to understand the basic differences of light, you won't be able to reconstruct a complete image with your mind.
***

I think you're exactly right about this. If I decide to retire to Greece in a few years, I will seek your advice where to settle.

(Note: the second and third links in this post were wrong; they have been corrected ...)

By the way, if you liked the Yazdjian clip, you should like this one:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=156278624426933

even though it's by a Turkish Armenian doing one of the most famous Turkish club songs there is - half the belly-dancers in the world use this song for the "veil" segment of their performance. i.e. their "veil-work".

Also, the oud player on this clip ("Chick Ganimian")

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a5Xh7BZjF40

was a legend from the 1950's to the 1980's on both sides of the ocean - again, another Turkish Armenian who could express BOTH cultures, Turkish and Armenian. (When the clip was filmed in 1984, he was recovering from a 20-yr bout with alcoholism, so he had lost some of the power he had as a younger healthier man.)

I spent six years immersed in Turkish Armenian culture on this side of the ocean living in this woman's studio:

http://www.anahidsofianstudio.com/

so maybe that's why I can see "authentic" Armenian feeling even when it's distorted by "modernization" like in the first clip I posted (the one with the dancers.)

But that's enough about Armenians - this is after all a Greek forum, right?

Hi guys! I just watched: https://www.youtube.com/embed/quhlxIqw_EA

When I saw that it was the Kohar group's creation, I thought it would be very true to Armenian culture, but I have to agree with
Amethystos in that the Armenian soul is missing from this music. I was hesitant to continue listening as soon as I heard the saxophone (as this is a completely foreign instrument with regards to Armenian music), but I kept an open mind and kept listening. At 3:27, I was relieved and you can tell the crowd is excited when we finally hear "Armenian-ness."

David Halitsky, you're completely on the money, and it's clear that you know what Armenian dancing looks like. I do see it in the video, but because of the absence of the culturally rich Armenian music, the dancing is pretty much not noticeable and gone to waste. I mean the dancing and music do not complement one another, so it just doesn't work for me.

I think this music does a really good job capturing the basic principals of Armenian culture: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giYmignnw1c

Also, this playlist: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...8fzbznPEZ446Ns

These are bits of ancient music for which we have dances that have been passed from generation to generation. Each dance has its own history and says a lot about Armenian history and way of life. "Yarkhushta" for example, is a fighting dance. If you check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rxnx7i1pt-0 , you will see the clapping motion. Those symbolize gun shots. Before, they would actually shoot into the air to celebrate victory. Our men created this dance when we were protecting our homeland from the Turks. You can sense the "battle" mentality in the dancing.

And our "kochari" dance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONsV3SbvYVE AND https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=733EtpHBD_s

You can see how that dance of unity arose-- again, in our many fights to stop the Turks from stealing our homeland. Guess who the people wearing the fezzes are.

Hello "AtB" -

Very nice to make your acquaintance. (But I have to tell you that I personally knew MANY Turkish and Turkish Armenian musicians and dancers in NYC who got along very well ... so you may not like my "politics".)

Anyway, would very much like to talk to you about various matters, so look for me to start a new thread in the "Armenian" translations section

http://www.allthelyrics.com/forum/fo...play.php?f=133

It would not be appropriate to discuss such Armenian matters here in the Greek forum.

One thing I will be asking you for in particular is good examples of Armenian 6/8's like

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybrXjSQFoKM

Again, best regards.

Thanks for replying ARMENIAtheBEAUTIFUL!

It's an honor and a privilege for us to read the words of an expert!

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Hello "AtB" -

Very nice to make your acquaintance. (But I have to tell you that I personally knew MANY Turkish and Turkish Armenian musicians and dancers in NYC who got along very well ... so you may not like my "politics".)

Anyway, would very much like to talk to you about various matters, so look for me to start a new thread in the "Armenian" translations section

http://www.allthelyrics.com/forum/fo...play.php?f=133

It would not be appropriate to discuss such Armenian matters here in the Greek forum.

One thing I will be asking you for in particular is good examples of Armenian 6/8's like

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybrXjSQFoKM

Again, best regards.

Hi David. I just want to clear something up-- I, myself, am an Armenian from Western Armenia (now Eastern Turkey) [so I fall within what you call "Turkish Armenian" even though Armenians, even from modern day Turkey, do not call themselves Turkish Armenian as is understood in the English language. We call ourselves "Armenian from Erzurum" or "Armenian from Mush" or "Armenian from Dyarbekir"] Anyway, I have many Turkish friends, and hope you don't think I hate Turks. We were talking about the essence of culture... so I talked about a big part of Armenian culture and reality--- we've been in constant struggle to protect our homeland ever since the Turks migrated from central Asia onto what is today "Turkey."

I don't think it's right to censor the truth even if the truth may be shameful for a certain group of people. If you'd prefer to not discuss it, that's cool too. Still, it is a reality that this constant struggle for preservation of Armenian identity IS Armenian culture and a way of life that has been caused by our Turkish neighbors' attempts to annihilate the Armenian race and country.

That is not to say that I hate all Turks or that I don't enjoy Turkish music. That couldn't be further from the truth.

Thanks for grabbing my attention, Amethystos!!

Thanks for taking the time to speak candidly of these sensitive matters, AtB.

I think we are in agreement.

The past should not be denied nor ignored, but neither should it be allowed to determine the future.

Otherwise, we are without hope - not only of heaven, but also of heaven on earth.

Originally Posted by David Halitsky

Thanks for taking the time to speak candidly of these sensitive matters, AtB.

I think we are in agreement.

The past should not be denied nor ignored, but neither should it be allowed to determine the future.

Otherwise, we are without hope - not only of heaven, but also of heaven on earth.

I couldn't agree more!!

AtB -

I've posted over in the Armenian forum

http://www.allthelyrics.com/forum/sh...64#post1035564

so whenever you have chance to look at the post, I'd be grateful.