arabic grammar questions

Hi

For those experts in the classical arabic grammar here are some questions as this poor soul is confused.

What is the difference between لم and لن
they are both for negation but how do we know to use which one?

Im not an expert, but heres my explanation. They're both called a7kam nafi, so techniqually they're very similar

لن is normally followed by a feminine action, something called nafi ilistiqbal
i.e lan taf3al

لم is normally followed by a masculine action. 7okm nafi for past and singular verbs
i.e lam yaf3al

Makes any sense?

wow gosh who was ur teacher?! mashaAllah impressive.

I was confused thought lan was for future actions that had not yet occured...! dont ask where i got that from.

If you really want to know...

Al Najah saturday school run by Mayfair on the behalf of Qatar

There arent set rules I think, so my argument is probably flawed, but its how I tend to think of it.

Lan ya7san - wont happen (future) so yours works too!

Hey how are you girls...

I'd like to make some correction regarding لم & لن usage...
Oh my God Viva what have just done! You're a great translator, but....
Yani as far as I know Arabic & its grammar, this is the first time I hear about hte relation between particles of negation and gender.
Oh my God you shocked me


لن: is for negating things or actions in future time, whlie
لم: is for negating things or actions that alerdy happened in past
In both cases you use verbs in present time

هذا لن يحدث this won't happen
هذا لم ي حدث this didn't happen
الطفل لن يأكل طعامه: The child (boy) will not eat his food
الطفل لم يأكل طعامه: The child (boy) didn't eat his food
الطفلة لن تأكل طعامها: The child (girl) won't eat her food
الطفلة لم تأكل طعامها: The child (girl) didn't eat her food
أنا لم افعل ذلك: I didn't do that
أنا لن أفعل ذلك: I won't do that

Wish you the best All

Ooops Sorry Rose Oriee to the rescue!

Originally Posted by VivaPalestina

Ooops Sorry Rose Oriee to the rescue!

guess that al najah place wasnt all that after all...

Sorry for sticking my nose here!

I guess Rose may already know this, but just in case:

-after lan the verb takes fatha at the end
-after lam it takes sukkun (although there are some exceptions)

Oh no dont blame madrast ilnajah! They told me the right bits, i.e 7okm nafi, nafi istiqbal for lan and past and singular nafi for lam. That part matches Oriee's descripion. The masculine/feminine thing was my own initiative Never take your own initiative Or at least not mine, I have crazy ideas

But hey, Oriee's around to teach us and save the day! Our hero

Absolutely correct and thank you teacher for your great addition

how do we know when to use ما and when to use ليس

they are both use to negate the jumla ismiyyah right (nominal sentences)... but how do we know when to use which one.

I've been searching since last week to find a good way to explain this issue...

First you should know the difference between الجملة الإسمية والجملة الفعلية
- فالجملة الأسمية: (Nominal Phrase) is the sentence that begins with noun (any kind of noun).
like:
الجو حار
الولد يركض
الصبي نائم
أحمد يلعب مع أصدقائه
- وأما الجملة الفعلية: (Verbal Clause) is the sentence that begins with a verb
like:
ذهبت إلى السوق مع صديقتي
يغادر القطار بعد برهة من الزمن

Now for ليس, it's only used wiht Nominal Clauses.
ليست الوردة متفتحة
ليس أحمد من فعلها
ليس الدرس صعبا
While ما is used for both Verbal Clauses as well as Nominal Clause
ما تفتحت الوردة
ما درست الدرس
ما يضيق حق وراءه مطالب
It has the same meaning when it's used with nominal clauses, ie: has the same meaning
ما الوردة متفتحة
ما الدرس صعب

I hope I helped

Originally Posted by citlalli

Sorry for sticking my nose here!

I guess Rose may already know this, but just in case:

-after lan the verb takes fatha at the end
-after lam it takes sukkun (although there are some exceptions)

o my gosh, ur not sticking ur nose in. i love all the help i get its so appreciated

ok in a arabic sentence, when the verb starts the sentence off... does that verb always have to be either masculine singular or feminine singular?

Originally Posted by red_rose

ok in a arabic sentence, when the verb starts the sentence off... does that verb always have to be either masculine singular or feminine singular?

Hi Red Rose

Yes always

red_rose, Arabic is one of the languages whose verbs are gender- and number-specific, this means that verbs in Arabic are always formed according to both the gender and number of the subject(s) of the sentence, or even the gender and number of the object(s) if it was the passive voice

for example (don't mind the "tashkeel"):

"Huwa yal3ab al-kura." (Means "He plays soccer.") << Here, "yal3ab" is used specifically because the subject is masculine and singular

it does not matter whether u r gonna start the sentence using the verb or not, the verb anywhere will be gender- and number-specific

in the same example, if u start with the verb "Yal3ab huwa al-kura.", the same

this feature of Arabic is very useful because it reduces ambiguity, however, there is some stuff that is still ambiguous in Arabic, for example, the verb "tal3ab" can both mean "you play" (short of "anta tal3ab") or "she plays" (short of "hiya tal3ab"), in this case the context will tell which one u mean, but in case it does not the speaker must add the subject to clarify

hope this helps

Len - I think the placement of the verb does matter, its always better to start a sentance with the verb, for example, the boy is playing with the ball

alwald yal3ab bilkora (here the noun starts --> its weaker)
yal3ab alwalad bilkora (starts with the verb, much stronger)

yeah this is right VivaPalestina, but this is in case Arabic is used rhetorically or in official writing, but if u r just using Arabic as a language to communicate, u can use both

in Arabic slang in all countries, we never start with the verb, unless we r stressing the action

nice to talk to u

You too dear I only mentioned it because I know warde is trying to learn classical arabic

Originally Posted by citlalli

Hi Red Rose

Yes always

Let's try making sentences to see... eventhough I agree totally with dearest cici's reply.

يلعب الأولاد في الخارج.
يساعد الولدان اباهما.
تدرس الطالبات دروسهن.
تشاهد الفتاتان التلفاز.
أعمل في الصباح الباكر.
نخرج في المساء سويًأ.

Ok, so what I noticed with you guys, that Yes, they start mostly with sing. fem/masc. if you are using ضمائر الغائب which are (هو هي هما هم هن), but if you are using ضمائر المتكلم which are (أنا، نحن), the situation changes to either أ if I am who is speaking, or ن if we are speaking.