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  1. #1
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    Post Greek to English

    Can an expert Greek translate this.

    Sameron adion aso (Σαμερον αδιον ασω) - Theocritus (Idylls)

  2. #2
    Senior Member David Halitsky's Avatar
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    If you just Google the phrase "Σαμερον αδιον ασω", you will see that all the experts are agreed. It means:

    "(but the) tomorrow is yet to come".

    Just click on this link:

    https://www.google.com/search?q=%CE%...sm=93&ie=UTF-8

  3. #3
    Ange ou Demon Amethystos's Avatar
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    "Today I shall sing more sweetly / I shall sing a sweeter song"

    You can find a whole thread about it here -> http://www.translatum.gr/forum/index.php?topic=1370.0
    "Gilgamesh, where are you hurrying to?
    You will never find that life for which you are looking.
    When the gods created man they allotted to him death,
    but life they retained in their own keeping"

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  5. #4
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    From evfokas:
    http://lyricstranslate.com/en/forum/...comment-231611

    Classical greek has complex orthography to reflect pronunciation so the phrase you provided is vague, to mention a few of the meanings that come to mind:
    Σάμερον ἀείδων ἄσω > Today let me gorge with singing (most probable meaning)
    Σάμερον ἀηδών ᾀσῶ > Today let me sing (as sweetly as a?) nightingale
    Σάμερον Ἀηδών ᾀσῶ > Today let me sing (as sweetly as?) Aedon (daughter of Pandareus son of Merops)
    Σάμερον ἀειδῶν ᾀσῶ > Today let me sing about ghostly (or shapeless or unformed or spitirual) things

    I can say though with certainty that the phrase doesn't speak about tomorrow, since tomorrow is called αὔριον/ἐπαύριον/εἰσαύριον/ἀεστητόν/ἕως/ἄας/ἀώς/ἀβώρ/αὔως the only phrase that may contain tomorrow would differ a bit:
    Σάμερον ἀείδων ἅως > Today singing about the morrow

  6. #5
    Senior Member David Halitsky's Avatar
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    Hi asasas - I'm sorry to have pointed you to a bunch of "experts" who seem to have been wrong - this reminds me of the famous line attributed to Betrand Russell - "When the experts are agreed, the opposite opinion can NOT be adopted as certain" (this is typical Brit understatement for "the opposite opinion is probably CORRECT").

    But regarding ἀείδων vs ἀηδών, how are you using the term "Classical"? On the one hand, I assume you are not using the term to include "Homeric", but on the other hand, I thought that ἀείδ- with the "εί" is strictly Homeric, as in the Iliad's opening line

    "Μῆνιν ἄειδε, θεὰ, Πηληϊάδεω Ἀχιλλῆος

    The reason why I have always thought this is because anyone who tries to get an internal reconstruction of ἄειδε is going to have a difficult time (unless new sources have come to light since I took my historical IE linguistics course back in 1969.)

    Is the "ει" attested in Attic?

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    Original Text: Full Line Translated
    Theocritus Rendered Into English Prose
    https://books.google.com/books?id=AI...%20%22&f=false
    Farewell, oh, farewells manifold, ye Muses, and I, some future day, will sing you yet a sweeter song.

    Or this one: IDYLL I. The Death of Daphnis.
    http://www.theoi.com/Text/TheocritusIdylls1.html

    [143] There; give me the goat and the tankard man; and the Muses shall have a libation of her milk. Fare you well, ye Muses, and again fare you well, and I’ll e’en sing you a sweeter song another day.

    Or this one:
    https://www.gutenberg.org/files/1153...-h.htm#IDYLL_I

    Now give me goat and cup; that I may milk
    The one, and pour the other to the Muse.
    Fare ye well, Muses, o'er and o'er farewell!
    I'll sing strains lovelier yet in days to be.

  8. #7
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    From evfokas
    http://lyricstranslate.com/en/forum/...comment-231749

    By classical I mean both ancient and Koine Greek, including Homeric and Attic Greek
    Yes ει as far as I know is a diphthong in Attic Greek

    Sameron adion aso is wrong, here is Idyll 1 [144-145] Thyrsis (The Death of Daphnis)
    Ὦ χαίρετε πολλάκι, Μοῖσαι χαίρετ᾽· ἐγὼ δ᾽ ὔμμιν καὶ ἐς ὕστερον ἅδιον αἰσῶ
    A literal translation: Oh many a farewell, Muses farewell; I for you(r sake) also in the future I'll sing even more sweeter/pleasantly
    A latin transliteration: es hýsteron háthion aesó

  9. #8
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    ABSTRACT
    http://www.academia.edu/3049191/_Col...Grasmere_1994_

    In his (misleading) preface to ‘Kubla Khan’, Coleridge misquotes the excipit of Thyrsis’song in Theocritus’ first idyll:

    ‘[…] the author has frequently purposed to finish for himself what had been originally, as it were, given to him.
    Σαµερον αδιον ασω but the to-morrow is yet to come.’

    Theocritus’ υστερον (sometime) is replaced by Σαµερον (now) in 1816, and by
    αυριον (tomorrow) in 1834. I suggest that the latter is in fact a Miltonic interference, as the Greek source is echoed in the closing line of Milton's 'Lycidas': 'Tomorrow to fresh woods and pastures new'. In other words, Coleridge quotes Theocritus
    via Milton. In his ‘intralinguistic ‘ mind, the two texts overlapped.

    In a marginal note to ‘Lycidas’, Coleridge, however defending Milton’s lexical choices against the comments of the editor, had remarked:

    ‘I am bound , however to confess that in the five last lines of this stanza I find more of the fondness of a classical scholar for his favourite classics than of the self-subsistency of a Poet destined to be himself a Classic, - more of the Copist of Theocritus and his Copist, Virgil, than of the free Imitator,who seizes with a strong hand whatever he wants or wishes for his own purpose and justifies the seizure by the improvement of the material or the superiority of the purpose to which it is applied.'

    Coleridge’s misquotation and his remark on Milton’s handling of his source invite to explore the relationship among the three texts in question: Theocritus' ‘Idyll I’, Milton's 'Lycidas' and Coleridge's 'Kubla Khan'. All foreground their metapoetic concern and present different voices and personae, inc1uding the persona of the poet qua poet.

    Also for this reason 'Lycidas' appealed to the romantic poet.
    In my enquiry into the fortune of ‘Lycidas’, with special reference to its influence on Coleridge's 'Kubla Khan', I have availed myself of suggestions from two areas of scholarship that are finally reuniting, thus fulfilling L. Cooper ’s pioneer plea (1905): ‘let the reader of Coleridge be also a reader of Coleridge’s master, Milton.

    ’Coleridge's notes and marginalia suggest that he consciously referred to Milton’s poem in 'Kubla Khan': ‘Lycidas’ contributed to its versification, to its sound, its movement, imagery and themes.

    Reading of 'Kubla Khan' with Milton’s poetry in mind has lead me to detect and uncover a consistent Miltonic hypotext, where Book IX of Paradise Lost has pride of place.

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